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Brokered Convention Problems For Santorum (Plus New MI Poll)

I am going to get a little more local-based for this post as I published much of this at my regular spot at my local Patch.com, but I am sure what I have below is being repeated in state after state and could be a potential problem for Rick Santorum should this come down to a brokered convention when delegates are free to vote for whomever they want instead of how their state is pledged during a primary.

At this weekend’s fundraiser for the Howard County Republican Party, I think I heard the name “Rick Santorum” in the span of two hours more than I have heard his name in the past six months combined at similar Republican events. Clearly his wins last Tuesday and his rise in polls across the country are fueling much of this. As far as I could tell, only Mitt Romney, Newt Gingrich, and Ron Paul have had a campaign structure of any type in Maryland while Santorum has never really set up a campaign in Maryland. I am not saying there is not a “Maryland for Santorum” campaign out there somewhere, but I have not found it and if it does exist, they have not made much of an effort to be found.

You can see how little organization there was from the Santorum when it comes to the primary ballot in Maryland for the candidates for Delegate to the Republican National Convention. This could actually matter should there be a brokered convention (if no candidate receives a majority of pledged delegates in the primary process) and the delegates are then free to cast their ballots at the convention. In Maryland, candidates for delegate can be affiliated with a campaign and these affiliations are usually given by the respective campaigns at the filing deadline (January 6th). I am only speaking by memory now, but I believe the delegates affiliated with the Presidential candidate that wins in Maryland are usually the ones who end up winning their respective delegate races as well.

In each congressional district, a Presidential campaign can affiliate their candidate with up to three of the candidates running. In the three districts in Howard County, Romney, Gingrich and Paul all had three names on the ballot for delegate in each district while Santorum’s campaign has only two names for Districts 2 and 3 while having no one affiliated with their campaign in District 7. In other words, at least five of the nine delegates elected for the Republican National Convention from these three districts will be ones who may not support Santorum at the convention should no candidate actually reach a majority of delegates nationwide. At the Alternate Delegate level, once again Romney, and Paul filled all of their slots with Gingrich filling eight of the nine, but Santorum’s campaign has only three of the nine slots filled (one in District 2 and two in District 7).

It might seem minor in the grand scheme of things, but it does illustrate how upstart the Santorum campaign really is and how little organization they had even as little as a month ago. You probably also have some candidates for delegate affiliated with some campaigns that have already ended (Rick Perry) that are wishing they could have associated themselves with Rick Santorum instead at this point.

Like I said, I am sure this is happening in state after state. With that out of the way and the next primary a little more than two week’s away, we have another poll out from Public Policy Polling which shows Rick Santorum even further ahead of Mitt Romney than the poll this morning from ARG.

PRESIDENT – MICHIGAN – GOP PRIMARY (PPP)
Rick Santorum 39%
Mitt Romney 24%
Ron Paul 12%
Newt Gingrich 11%

Romney and Paul seemed relatively static between the two polls, but PPP seems to suggest a lot more of the anti-Romney vote in Santorum’s camp than the ARG poll shows. The PPP poll was done February 10-12 among 404 likely primary voters with a margin of error of +/- 4.9%.

Posted by Dave at 12:38 pm
Filed under: General | Comments (289)

289 Responses to “Brokered Convention Problems For Santorum (Plus New MI Poll)”

  1. Wes says:

    God, I hope Republicans don’t nominate Santorum.

  2. GF says:

    Good day Wes, how fare thee?

  3. jan says:

    Maybe a Brokered Convention could save us from the insanity of the GOP primary voter?

    The Democrats were smart to add super delegates to there numbers. If Republicans had super-delegates a lot of this would not matter.

  4. Bill T says:

    A brokered convention is a problem for every candidate running. Why go with the four clowns when Christie, Jindal, Daniels, Bush, Rubio, DeMint etc become an option…

  5. GF says:

    3- We do have them, jan, but not nearly as many much less in numbers even noticeable enough to warrant mention. The RNC has a paltry 63 seats reserved on the floor; those pitiful numbers equate to our “superdelegate” count.

  6. KnightHawk says:

    PPP-MI poll results: WTFO?

  7. Tim says:

    I don’t think you want a brokered convention, folks. It would be a nightmare, with a fractured Party emerging. I don’t, for one minute, buy the scenario of the “man on the white horse” riding in to save the thing. Better to let the voters decide the nominee, now.

    Plus, I still think there is little chance of this thing going to the Convention. Romney can make things easier if he closes the deal on Super Tuesday.

  8. Tim V says:

    I’m guessing the ARG poll is the more accurate of the two. PPP/Kos has an adgenda and they don’t care (my suspicion) about accuracy until the final days.

  9. Tim V says:

    7- agree

  10. CPA says:

    Stop saying brokered. Open, multi-ballot, contested, undecided. PLEASE, say anything but brokered. Ay dios mio, where is Rush when I need him

  11. jenny says:

    if Mitt can’t defeat Santorum, he doesn’t deserve the nomination. Also, Goldwater didn’t stand a chance against Johnson. The 1964 election was nearly a year after Kennedy’s assassination. The economy was really strong because of the Kennedy tax cuts. Rockefeller would’ve lost in a landslide also.

    go mitt!

  12. DW says:

    I put “Brokered Convention” into the same category as “Angels from Heaven” and “Reagan resurrects from the dead.”

    It isn’t going to happen. It was the stuff of the 19th century, not today. The ballots cast for candidates in the primary will be the ones that lock in delegates for the eventual GOP nominee.

    People need to stop fantasizing about candidates who did not run and start coming to grips with the four who are still running. Need to choose one of these four. Of these four, only one has credibility to be POTUS. It is the one candidate who has extensive executive experience and is fully vetted and has the money and organization to take a real shot at beating Obama. That candidate is Mitt Romney. Like him or not, he will be the option on the ballot opposite Barack Hussein Obama.

  13. jason says:

    A brokered convention is Wobbie’s wet dream but it won’t happen.

    I notice the moron was back on the other thread.

    ” Santorum’s positions will NOT result in a predestined loss in indies, mods and women. It just wont.”

    Nahhh, of course it won’t. Women and Indies will just love Santorum’s bizarre views, especially when Obama spends 800 million to highlight them.

  14. Bitterlaw says:

    It’s good to see Wes return. I thought he would have been back yesterday with a 500 word rant on Lincoln’s birthday. Stay around, Wes. MD is on a break and the trolls are restless.

  15. Kevin says:

    For the second straight time, the ppp poll cross tabs show the sample was over weighted with evangelicals. PPP is a democratic polling operation. This is best evidence yet that dems do NOT want to face Romney.

  16. DW says:

    Gallup tracking…

    Mitt 32% (-2)
    Rick 30% (+3)
    Newt 16% (-)
    Paul 8% (-)

    And now all of their days are after 2/7.

  17. EML says:

    Many thoughts today…

    1) I fear this Santorum bump is here to stay. Voters have left Gingrich and coalesced around Santorum as the not-Romney.

    2) No one is voting FOR Santorum. They are voting AGAINST Romney.

    3) The MSM and Dems want Obama to face anyone other than Romney. They know Obama will win handily if Santorum is the nominee.

    4) The brain dead ABRs keeping spouting off about how Romney can only win when he spends money. This is because Dems and the MSM have created the narrative that Romney is a far left liberal and the other Republican candidates are more conservative and Romney has to spend money to combat it, while Santorum can sit back and let the MSM do the work for him. It’s a shame that the supposed base has fallen for the MSM ruse.

    5) In the general, Santorum won’t be able to sit back and have the MSM do the work for him. The MSM will then be attacking him. How does Santorum get people to vote FOR him (instead of having people vote AGAINST his opponent, which is the case now)? 2012 isn’t going to be ABO; the R candidat needs to garner his own support. How is Santorum going to do this, build a GOTV machine, with no money and no organization?

    6) A brokered convention would be a catastrophic failure. We have Erickson and others on the far right hoping to get to a brokered convention. But what then? What’s the end game? Who’s the nominee and how do they put together a winning game plan in 2 months?

  18. jason says:

    CPA has just put the best spin on the fact Santorum is a huge earmarker and porker:

    ” Rick seems to be big government because the federal judiciary has tyrannically usurped these issues from the local authorities based on a supposed SDP.”

    Rick just “seems” to be big government.

    LOL

  19. DW says:

    So after all the Rickmentum from 2/7, Gallup still has Romney in the lead.

  20. janz says:

    Santorum, like Gingrich, has a record full of holes and conservative ‘tears.’ It has been coming out in a singular fashion, by different posters, but has really yet to be aired publically and via debate (except between Ron Paul and Santorum).

    The next debate comes on the 22nd, prior to the primaries in MI and Arizona. So, this will offer Romney an opportunity to vet Santorum in front of the electorate.

  21. SUSYQUE says:

    I just sent an e-mail to Rush who is commenting on Mitt changing his mind of abortion. This is what I wrote: My dear Rush…if you changed your mind on 4 wives, why can’t Romney change his view on abortion? Most of us have changed as we have matured and realize abortion is wrong.
    …………..
    I log-in so I know he gets the e-mail.

  22. SoHope says:

    #11 it is harder than you think to win a primary as a serious candidate when you have a new person every month without a GE care in the world bashing you.

    There will aways be another candidate that would lower taxes a bit more (0% with one candidate), be a little more outrageous, and pander a little more to the small slice that determines the primary at the detriment of the general election.

  23. DW says:

    “2) No one is voting FOR Santorum. They are voting AGAINST Romney. ”

    At the risk of being called all sorts of names, I will correct this item to read:

    2) No one is voting FOR Santorum. They are voting FOR Obama.

  24. Tim says:

    #13:
    I agree with your assessment…….

  25. jason says:

    ” I log-in so I know he gets the e-mail.”

    I am sure he does. He searches his inbox every five minutes for it.

    In fact, when you don’t write him, he whines on the air.

    She doesn’t write, she doesn’t call…..

  26. jan says:

    People see a Brokered Convention has the last best hope and that is why it keeps coming up.

  27. Waingro says:

    I bet Santorum will be ahead of Mitt in the Gallup tracking by the end of the week.

  28. lisab says:

    no new big name would run in a brokered convention. they know obama would crush them and end their career.

  29. SoHope says:

    We can all agree on this:

    Santorum is more socially conservative than Romney used to be.

    and

    Romney is more fiscally conservative than Santorum used to be.

  30. jason says:

    A brokered convention is an asinine idea and fortunately it won’t happen.

    There is no shining knight to take over, and this conversation is just a ruse to help defeat Romney and elect Obama. A brokered convention means the candidate would have zero money, zero organization and zero time to conduct a campaign.

    Those that think Obama is better than Romney should vote for him.

    Otherwise stop whining.

  31. CPA says:

    Murtha was a bigger earmarker than Santorum. Earmarks were once thought of as a good counterbalance to the slow pace of bureaucratic approval and control of federal spending. Of course the corrupt legislatures turned it into a campaign contribution money machine.

    The bureaucracy screwed up the stimulus of 2009 because it takes 3-5 years to get any project approved without congressional intervention.

    But then again local construction spending has been corrupt for as long as my grandfather can remember.

  32. CPA says:

    Santorum will be ahead of MItt in Gallup as of Tomorrow.

  33. jason says:

    ” Romney is more fiscally conservative than Santorum used to be.”

    Wrong. Romney is STILL more fiscally conservative than Santorum.

  34. Brandon says:

    #19. For now. Let’s see where it is in a couple of days.

  35. SoHope says:

    so earmarks used to be swell…and Murtha was better than Santorum. Atleast put those 2 stupid statements in sperate paragraphs.

  36. lisab says:

    “Santorum is more socially conservative than Romney used to be.

    and

    Romney is more fiscally conservative than Santorum used to be.”

    not sure about that

    romney is mormon

    they are uber-socially conservative

    they just don’t talk about it every 10 seconds

  37. Waingro says:

    Santorum has never been a “fiscal conservative”. Moderate at best. He’s absolutely the WRONG candidate for this cycle.

  38. jason says:

    ” Murtha was a bigger earmarker than Santorum. ”

    Ok, if a corrupt party hack like Murtha is the bar, I guess I agree.

    Santorum should run with that “endorsement”.

    “Murtha was a bigger earmarker than me”.

  39. jan says:

    I can not understand any circumstances vote for Rick Santorum if he is the nominee. The very taught is offensive to me as a liberty loving American and has a women.

  40. J T says:

    Of Course Brandon and his pals at PPP, said Newt would be the nominee after South Carolina.

  41. jason says:

    ” I bet Santorum will be ahead of Mitt in the Gallup tracking by the end of the week.”

    Maybe, but it will level off and start dropping again. Most of the pro-Santorum surge in the Gallup rolling average ended yesterday.

  42. jenny says:

    I will vote for Roseanne Barr if Santorum is the nominee!

  43. SoHope says:

    Maybe we can nominate Murtha in a brokered convention…with Newt as VP on a webcam in the bedroom platform.

    TRIFECTA BABY!

  44. janz says:

    EML’s #17 post gives a lucid analysis of why Santorum may not follow the usual route of front runners that Romney has had to deal with.

    What EML says about the ABR’s and their hard-headedness towards even re-thinking their reasons for not liking Romney, is so true. These people will nitpick abortion fallacies, while skimming over Santorum’s RTW and union backing. They will talk endlessly about Romney’s MA health care, and not quibble an iota about Newt’s promotion of healthcare mandates, or various lucrative jobs held as a lobbyist for big government programs.

    Another problem with Santorum, now being the alternative to Romney, is that there is literally no one else waiting on the docket for people to turn to. He is the last one of the ABRs, and so people will probably cling to his candidacy, showing more denial as to his flaws, than they have done with others who held that option-to-Romney place before Santorum.

  45. SoHope says:

    jan and jenny, I wouldn’t go that far, but it’s your vote.

  46. lisab says:

    i went to visit the first mormon temple in ohio once … with a mormon friend

    it is NOT part of the same group as the salt lake mormons, but same basic beliefs

    the guide told me a big part of his church’s public image is trying to publicly get along with others in the community … which stems from the killings of mormons that used to occur

    he basically said, that in their private life they are mormon, but publicly they try to be as respectful and tolerant of others beliefs as they can … so they don’t get shot :)

    this seems to be true of romney, and was why he was successful in massachusetts … you never heard him insult others even when he disagreed

  47. lisab says:

    i also would not vote for santorum … but i at least would not vote for obama

    if gingrich is the nominee i WOULD vote for obama

  48. jason says:

    CPA’s spin on pork reminds me of HD’s “immigration doesn’t matter” when Perry’s pro-amnesty stance was divulged.

    In a year where we are at 16 trillion in the hole heading for 20 trillion somehow the “pork used to be good” argument won’t sell very well.

    But once again the hypocrisy is astounding.

    Now we have “true conservatives” basically saying “spending doesn’t matter”.

    Amazing.

  49. SoHope says:

    frankly, lisab, you don’t count. The fact that you frequent this place and quasi-support republicans amazes me.

    Easy come easy go.

  50. jason says:

    I would vote for Santorum no problem. Better than Obama.

  51. lisab says:

    “this seems to be true of romney, and was why he was successful in massachusetts … you never heard him insult others even when he disagreed”

    i think this is also one reason why some republicans don’t like romney

    he is NOT out for revenge

    he will try to do what is right for the country, but not do things just because it makes the dems mad.

    for example, he won’t just cut all funding for the arts just to piss off dems. he may cut funding for the arts citing the financial crisis, but he won’t cut it just because it is a dem program.

    he would say, “we can have school lunches or art …”

  52. Waingro says:

    I’m ABO but for if L. Ron. Paul becomes the nominee. In that case I either vote 3rd party or stay home.

  53. janz says:

    I cannot even conceive of a second Obama term! For me, Santorum is better than Gingrich. Romney remains the best of the field. Hopefully, people will be able to clear their heads and see this.

  54. SUSYQUE says:

    Christian Women Having Abortions
    by Heather Koerner on
    Yesterday, on the 35th anniversary of Roe v. Wade, I read a study by the Alan Guttmacher Institute reporting that one in five women having abortions claim to be born again or Evangelical Christians.

    If that’s correct, that would man that this last year over two hundred thousand of our Christian sisters had an abortion. Even if the number were half that, that is still a staggering number of women in crisis. It made me think, what must it be like to hear a celebration of the Sanctity of Human Life knowing that you had an abortion? All I can imagine is that it must be extraordinarily painful.

    This statistic helped to open my eyes. It’s easy to forget — especially since we don’t talk about it much — that there are post-abortive women in our churches, our Bible studies, our singles groups and, probably, reading this blog. Earlier this month, Focus on the Family issued a challenge to Christians to reach out to both post-abortive women and those at risk of an abortion.
    ……………………………………………….
    Average abortion in U.S.A = 3 million plus!

  55. lisab says:

    ” The fact that you frequent this place and quasi-support republicans amazes me.”

    i am anti-obama not pro-republican

  56. janz says:

    #51 good points lisab.

  57. SoHope says:

    I am still waiting for the teaparty candidate for NC governor to enter the GOP primary to take out McCrory and cost of the governor’s mansion.

  58. jan says:

    At this point I think we must prepare of a second Obama term.

  59. SUSYQUE says:

    #54…The point I am making is that if someone changes their mind about abortion being wrong…that is a good thing. No one should be judged for changing for the good. Think about it. How many woman at C-Pac had an abortion. How many Tea Party women had an abortion. If Romney flipped….it was a good and positive flip!

  60. Marv says:

    Bitterlaw,

    Lincolns’s Birthday doesn’t mean anything to me. BFD.

  61. Ray Tuleya says:

    The real problem of a brokered convention is the timing of it. If the nominee is not chosen until SEPTEMBER, that would lead them NO time to defeat Obama.

    If Santorum or Romney is going to win the nomination, it has to be done by the end of the primary season on June 5th.

  62. janz says:

    jan

    Maybe one should ‘prepare’ for a second Obama term. But, I wouldn’t thrown in the towel, by throwing away a vote.

  63. IDon'tWantMeNoMormon! says:

    Good for you Susyque and your email!

    Speak truth to power!!

  64. SoHope says:

    My mother is “baptist” but doesn’t attend church. She told me one time when I was a teenager that she had an abortion when I was a child. I am an only child but should have a little sister. She regrets it and was pressured by family.

  65. Ray Tuleya says:

    “SoHope”, lisab has been a solid supporter for a Long Long Time. Actually, if you “hate” anyone who could acually like Romney, then why are you on David’s website? He is a lot stronger supporter of Romney.

  66. IDon'tWantMeNoMormon! says:

    CPA spinning Earmarks now!

    Yeah that’s real tea party of you!!

    Admit it you’d support al sharpton over Mitt

  67. J T says:

    Jan you are a defeatist. Go build a bomb shelter why you are at it.

  68. lisab says:

    i admit i like romney because he is not a firebrand republican

    and

    he is from my state :)

    not only is he qualified to be president, he is tolerant of others

  69. J T says:

    Trolls and Gloomers have taken over HHR, no wonder many do not come here anymore.

    I saw this happen to Polipundit, and it seems to be happening here at Hedgehog.

    Very sad

  70. SoHope says:

    #65, when did I say that I “hated” lisab? I know lisab has been here awhile. I have been here about 4 years…you? My point is that she would vote for Obama over a republican that happens to be a dog turd is that as a utopian socialist and “I am suprise that she quasi-supports republicans…easy come easy go.”

    actually read my post before acting so “stupidly”

  71. J T says:

    Ray you are a intelligent and informative poster. We need you here more often

  72. DW says:

    58.At this point I think we must prepare of a second Obama term.

    Comment by jan — February 13, 2012 @ 1:28 pm

    why? most voters have not even come close to start paying attention, and most of the events that will shape voter decisions have not yet happened. This could still go all the way from an Obama blowout win, to a modestly impressive Romney win. I don’t see any scenerio for a Romney (1984-like) blowout, but he is very much in play.

  73. jan says:

    Unless you are blind everyone can see that this primary has made the possibility of Obama’s re-election much much more likely than a possibility. I choose to see things how they are not how I would like them to be.

  74. janz says:

    Pundits and pollsters I’ve listened to recently have tied Romney’s lowered numbers with Obama to the better UE and jobs stats that have recently come out. Romney’s popularity seems to be keenly associated with the economy, more than the other candidates.

    Drudge today had these headlines:

    Privately, Obama sees recovery ‘another year or two’ off…

    Rolls out $3.8 trillion budget; $1.4 trillion in new taxes…

    I think Romney will continue to have an issue in which to do battle!

  75. jan says:

    DW your assuming that Romney gets the nomination. Nobody can make that assumption with the type of GOP primary voters this cycle.

  76. lisab says:

    i would definitely support obama over gingrich

    actually, i almost like paul over gingrich

    except for his foreign policy, aka israel

  77. DW says:

    Jan, history is on my side. Primaries are often problematic and drawn out, and have little effect on the general election. Bill Clinton was not the favorite in 1992, got trounced in IA, and had a bloody primary campaign. Yet he won the general election. Same with Obama/Hillary. And yes, I think it is fair to assume Romney is the nominee. Others are as well.

  78. janz says:

    DW

    You’re a very ‘even’ poster. That quality is needed around here. Thanks!

  79. lisab says:

    Obama Bundler Earmarked Stimulus Money for Donors

    This is what Obama’s democracy looks like

    http://freebeacon.com/obama-bundler-earmarked-stimulus-money-for-donors/

  80. J T says:

    Romney will be the nominee

  81. SoHope says:

    ray ray, when did I say I hated lisab?

    We did get into it in the past regarding the *igot issue, the USS Arizona, Civil War, the Alamo, Arlington Cemetary, the death penalty…but never about Romney support.

  82. Bitterlaw says:

    Bitterlaw,

    Lincolns’s Birthday doesn’t mean anything to me. BFD.

    Comment by Marv — February 13, 2012 @ 1:29 pm

    Marv – I understand. I always figured that you are more likely to celebrate the birth of people who were responsible for killing Americans. People like Lord Cornwallis, Robert E. Lee, Hitler, Ho Chi Minh . . .

  83. SoHope says:

    http://www.wsoctv.com/news/news/local/youtube-dad-who-shot-daughters-laptop-gets-visit-a/nHbcR/

    This is a local story that has gotten a little bit of national coverage. Someone called DSS on him.

  84. DW says:

    78…you can be sure that if in the unlikely event that circumstances change so that Romney is no longer favored to be the nominee, I would come here and admit it. I am not about cheering hopeless positions. I deal with reality as best I can. That’s why I am not holding out hope that an angel from heaven will deliver a magical savior-candidate, nor do I hold that Obama’s re-election is inevitable.

  85. GF says:

    The men in big hats are not going quietly into the night despite the supposed compromise, it would seem;

    “The United States Conference of Catholic Bishops denounced the modification in a lengthy statement: ‘We will therefore continue – with no less vigor, no less sense of urgency – our efforts to correct this problem through the other two branches of government.’”

    But will they be “no less sincere” in their continued opposition? Bitter, I defer to you as the expert in such matters.

  86. janz says:

    DW

    I have a question for you. If you were a Romney advisor, what suggestions would you give him on how to run his campaign from now until the MI and Arizona primaries on the 28th?

  87. DW says:

    Does everyone realize that one of the chief Catholic voices battling Obama is Archbishop Timothy Dolan from Milwaukee? And his brother is a conservative talk show host. Archbishop Dolan is very influential in WI, and WI is a state that could easily flip to the GOP. This unforced error of Obama could make up for the damage done to Wisconsin’s chances to flip via the union battle.

  88. DW says:

    86…I think MI is the battlefield. AZ should be pretty strong Mitt territory. In Michigan, I would tell Romney to go hard attacking Obama, and expose Santorum’s weaknesses. A good ad can do both at once. Show how Mitt will reverse the direction of Obama and how Rick would be more of the same.

  89. Bitterlaw says:

    I wish the Bishops would put this in perspective. Ask Muslims if they would approve of a Federal requirement that it serve bacon with all meals in Muslim affiliated organization. Ask Orthodox Jews if they would have a cafetaria for its employees that did not have separate facilities for kosher and non-kosher foods. Make sure they have the bacon cheeseburger with milkshakes on the menu, too.

  90. janz says:

    Rush owning the Santorum surge

    Above is an American Thinker article showing some of the meddling hypocrisy of Rush Limbaugh.

  91. janz says:

    DW

    It would be a fine line that Romney would have to walk, in such a MI ad campaign, as he has been so strongly criticized for going negative on his surging opponents. It could just as easily backfire on him, as much as work for him.

  92. janz says:

    Here is comes from Santorum:

    Santorum’s plan to derail Romney

  93. lisab says:

    muslims are against abortion too

    however somehow i don’t think the administration checks them too closely for compliance.

    muslims claim exemption from obamacare because islam is against health insurance …

  94. lisab says:

    seriously

    muslims may be exempt from obamacare

    (5) EXEMPTIONS FROM INDIVIDUAL RESPONSIBILITY REQUIREMENTS.—In the case of an individual who is seeking an exemption certificate under section 1311(d)(4)(H) from any requirement or penalty imposed by section 5000A, the following information [is required]:

    (A) In the case of an individual seeking exemption based on the individual’s status as a member of an exempt religious sect or division, as a member of a health care sharing ministry, as an Indian, or as an individual eligible for a hardship exemption, such information as the Secretary shall prescribe.

    Similarly, page 128 states:

    “(A) RELIGIOUS CONSCIENCE EXEMPTION.—Such term [i.e., "applicable individual"] shall not include any individual for any month if such individual has in effect an exemption under section 1311(d)(4)(H) of the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act which certifies that such individual is a member of a recognized religious sect or division thereof described in section 1402(g)(1) and an adherent of established tenets or teachings of such sect or division as described in such section.

  95. Waingro says:

    #94, yeah, but he calls it a “sensible compromise” which is laughable. He’s just spinning this for his messiah.

    If Barry did nothing, he wouldn’t have written the piece and kept his head in the sand.

  96. JackJ says:

    I wish jan the gloomer troll would have used a different handle instead of forcing the longtime poster jan to change hers.

  97. marc says:

    Its funny to watch some of you come to the realization of what I have been saying for months now. That this primary has been a complete and utter disaster for the Republican Party would and could lead to a worthless nomination and another Obama term. I was called an eyeore for simply stating the truth.

    When a party purges it’s intellectuals and policy conservatives and moderates all that is left are the crazies and the evangelicals, the ones who put the bible before the constitutions or think that Herman Cain would actually make a good President.

    The GOP voter is facing a choice to vote for candidates they know cant win. The smart ones still left.

  98. Corey says:

    Where do these people come from?

    Needless to say, with 267 days to go, the nomination of a major political party is quite worthy.

    With so many Americans believing the country is on the wrong track under Barack Obama, I could not imagine a more fertile time that he could be defeated by a strong candidate.

    Mitt Romney, after having to fight for a nomination, will be a strong candidate.

    I do not see how anything can be declared a “disaster” on February 13, when just a few cycles ago, the very first contests were being held.

  99. marc says:

    Ayatollah Rick Santorum in my opinion is no different then the reality tv based crazy Dugger family. Who unsurprisingly has endorsed Santorum.

  100. Annie says:

    Santorum’s rise in the polls is more media hype driven than people actually knowing the background of this man. His “wins” in the three caucuses last week, in which a low turn-out meant the evangelicals dominated the caucus goers, has been spun out of control by pundits and media. Time to vet this man, big time.

    I’m posting these quotes again, in case anyone missed them on the last thread:

    Quote from Barry Goldwater:   “Mark my word, if and when these preachers get control of the Republican party, and they’re sure trying to do so, it’s going to be a terrible damn problem. Frankly, these people frighten me. Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can’t and won’t compromise. I know, I’ve tried to deal with them.”

    And a quote of Santorum’s:  “One of the criticisms I make is to what I refer to as more of a Libertarianish right. They have this idea that people should be left alone, be able to do whatever they want to do, government should keep our taxes down, keep our regulations low, and that we shouldn’t get involved in the bedroom, we shouldn’t get involved in cultural issues. That is not how traditional conservatives view the world.”

    Obviously, Santorum does not understand traditional conservatism.

  101. BJG spy says:

    judyt2012 permalink

    I just sent Santorum $$$.

    We need the strongest conservative in the race and I understand that Santorum is polling well in Ohio.

    I’ll work for Santorum … put a big sign out by the highway, knock on doors, talk him up and work the polls on election day. (all things I will not do for Romney)

  102. Corey says:

    Calling Rick Santorum the Aytatollah or the Duggar Family “crazy” is not based in reality. He’s also not comparable to Mussolini and he is not a “far left Democrat.”

    If we want to win over Americans, be it in a general election or a primary, we ought to not attack others in an intellectually dishonest way.

    Leave that to the left or to Newt Gingrich, or for that matter to Rick Santorum, who has repeated the overwhelmingly verifiably false assertion that Mitt Romney once ran for the Senate “to the left” of Ted Kennedy.

  103. Corey says:

    As someone who wants to see Republicans win every race possible, I would not want those BGJ types knocking on any doors trying to talk to people.

  104. marc says:

    It is based in reality Corey. If Rick Santorum was a Muslim and running a religion based campaign what would you call him?

    Obiviously you have watch the antics of the Duggar family, they are crazy just like the Housewives of Jersey Shore.

  105. The South says:

    Stop whining. Would you like to be us? We have to choose between a Mormon and a Catholic!

  106. Corey says:

    I do not inherently think ill of Muslims, marc.

    Shame on anyone who does, as far as I am concerned.

  107. Annie says:

    Corey – There are enough quotes out of the mouth of Santorum that should scare the bejeezus out of almost all Americans (other than the ultra-religious types). Last October, Santorum said that when he heard JFK’s statement about separating Church and State (’cause he was a Catholic and some thought he’d be a follower of the Pope over American law), it made him [Santorum] want to throw up.

  108. Corey says:

    I’ve seen a bit of the Duggars shows here and there. They live their lives differently than I do, but I think they are a fine family.

  109. Annie says:

    A Santorum nomination would mean big losses down the tickets for House and Senate seats.

  110. Corey says:

    I agree Annie that things he has said are dangerous politically and often times would make for bad policy too, but I think it’s not going to win any votes for Romney or whomever, if we attack people in an over the top way.

  111. marc says:

    Also lets get the facts out there. Many of us only came to support Romney when it became very evident that nobody else credible much less electable would enter this primary. There was some hope for Rick Perry but he quickly proved himself unfit to run for Congress much less President. So Romney was the only non clown in a van full of clowns. Each one having his/her day in the sun only to be tripped up by their own stupidity or past.

  112. RickPerrysParakeet says:

    Its not intellectually dishonest

    Santorum is crazy, he’s a goddamned lunatic

    His voting record is atrocious and is far left

    I understand why Mitt and people supporting him wouldn’t agree with me but the above is true

    And he is a religious fascist and he does remind me of Mussolini (which is admittedly a personal opinion)

    There is not the slightest doubt in my mind that he would turn this country into a theocracy if he could get away with it

  113. janz says:

    #97 Jack

    FYI: I don’t consider ‘jan’ a troll, by any means. She has been a savvy poster. This primary, though, has had many twists and turns in it, enough to affect one’s perspective, for better or worse, on what is going on in this race for the nomination.

  114. Greymarch says:

    Here’s my advice to Romney…

    During the Feb.22nd debate, Romney should talk at length about the car industry in Detroit, how Obama made it worse, and how Romney will fix it. Romney has excellent knowledge of the Detroit-car industry, and sounds quite strong when he talks about it. This will get those blue-collar Reagan democrats to vote for Romney in the MI primary.

    I feel good about Romney’s chances in AZ. It’s gonna be all about MI. I hope Romney has enough cash on hand to weaken Santorum in MI.

  115. Corey says:

    That’s all out KOS rhetoric I’m hearing here.

    We are supposed to be better than that.

  116. Annie says:

    Corey – Santorum can be attacked by simply making an ad using his own statements, listing his votes and agendas he advocated, and his lack of experience in handling economics or a leadership role.

  117. Annie says:

    Isn’t Romney scheduled to make an economic speech in Michigan soon?

  118. RickPerrysParakeet says:

    Its true

    Santorum is a lunatic

    All you have to do is accurately quote him

  119. Corey says:

    Of course he can Annie. He has yet to be definied yet in the eyes of the regular voter (who is not an ideological or political junkie like we are.)

    But saying he is a religious fanatic is not going to hurt him at all. It would only help shore up his support.

  120. Marv says:

    #82 Bitterlaw,

    Robert E Lee was a great American patriot. He just had a little tough luck, that’s all.

  121. marc says:

    In a Republican primary yes. But to the general public Santorum is and will be portrayed effectively has everything that we are saying.

  122. Jerry muthertruckin' Cruncher says:

    I will say this once. My prediction: if Newt wants to put the hurt on Romney, all he has to do is pull out. He is the type that would do that too.

  123. Annie says:

    Corey – His religious fanaticism would only be a plus with the evangelicals. Even we Catholics think he’s way out there.

  124. marc says:

    After this election whatever the outcome the Republican Party needs to have a serious discussion about it’s future.

  125. janz says:

    #118 Annie, Romney has said he is going to roll out more on his economic plan for this country sometime mid-month.

    #102 For the most part. people over at that site are rabid anti-Romney, almost to the point of derangement.

  126. Corey says:

    *If* Newt pulled out, it would seem to help Santorum in the short-term, but I still do not think Santorum would be able to withstand the kind of campaign needed to beat Romney one on one across the country.

    One month from now, this all may very well be basically over in Romney’s favor. We need to see what happens in AZ and MI first two weeks from tomorrow. There will not be much that will happen this week to change any perception or media narrative.

    Things may change in the week leading up to the contests, but ultimately, things are frozen until the results from those two states are known.

  127. janz says:

    #123 Agree with that comment. Newt seems to be the vindictive type — never lets a grudge go without a response. A good one for Romney would be to put his election on suspension and then endorse Santorum, while Santorum is still rising and in the game.

    That would be ‘revenge plus!’

  128. Marv says:

    marc,

    Why do you have such a negative view of Santorum?

  129. marc says:

    Because I believe in liberty and freedom.

  130. Corey says:

    So, in lieu of complaining, have you done anything for Mitt Romney yet?

    Sent any money for example? Even a small, affordable amount?

  131. Tim V says:

    Corey says:
    February 13, 2012 at 2:43 pm
    Calling Rick Santorum the Aytatollah or the Duggar Family “crazy” is not based in reality. He’s also not comparable to Mussolini and he is not a “far left Democrat.”

    If we want to win over Americans, be it in a general election or a primary, we ought to not attack others in an intellectually dishonest way.

    I agree 100%, let’s keep it real and honest with some integrity and ethics. Santorum has pleny of weaknesses in his record that can be attacked. His lopsided loss to Casey is also fair game.

    Mitt needs a three pronged strategy:

    1.Attack Santorum
    2.Attack Obama
    3.Present his own positive vision for the country

    I think Romney represents the best chance of slightly de-polarizing the electorate and bringing Americans together. Obama is as far left as you can get. Romney can run a center right general election and win. For the primaries he needs to show any areas where Santorum is NOT or was not as conservative as he claims ( such as earmarks).

  132. marc says:

    Santorum believes it liberty and freedom also just has long it’s is according to his religious teachings.

  133. janz says:

    Romney’s case by Robert Costa.

    In the coming days, Romney plans to emphasize his retooled message, building upon his CPAC argument. “You go through the list,” he says as he discusses how he’ll frame his Bay State accomplishments. Fiscal issues, it seems, will form the heart of his stump speech. “We cut taxes 19 times. We balanced the budget.” But he will also tout his administration’s efforts to curb illegal immigration and his leadership on traditional marriage, abortion, and contraception.

    Romney will also get a little more personal in his public remarks, talking about his family and his background, from his immigrant grandfather to his father, George Romney, who rose from being a Mormon outcast in Mexico to become Michigan’s governor.

  134. EML says:

    Theres a little part of me that wants to see santorum win the nomination then get trounced by obama. Maybe then the Party Purists will finally get it.

  135. Corey says:

    Exactly Tim V.

    Now if you only your admirer, the cowardly LaZebra would take heed of those wise staments.

  136. Bill T says:

    Santorum was doomed to lose in 2006 no matter who ran against him, because he’d run, and won, his previous elections by toning down his social agenda and promoting himself as a fiscal conservative.

    Pennsylvania may average out to be a semi-bluish state, but it’s quite divided internally. The T is primarily socially conservative. The big cities are socially liberal. The smaller cities and the suburbs around the big cities are socially moderate and strongly fiscally conservative. On average, the fiscal conservative side is stronger than the fiscal liberals, while the social liberal side is stronger than the social conservatives.

    By 2006, it was clear Rick tilted completely the other way — his social agenda was way too far out of the mainstream, even for many social conservatives in the state, and he’d proved himself to not have a fiscal conservative bone in his body. Had anyone serious run against him in the Republican primary, he likely wouldn’t have even made it to the general election, and he had absolutely no chance in the general, IMHO.

    I, too, am at a loss as to why he’s even in the race here — except that maybe he’s serving the “Anyone but Romney” role. You don’t win the general election that way.

  137. Corey says:

    I think Romney probably wins both AZ and MI and that continues him on the path to what is believe it or not, a fairly smooth path to capturing an open nomination.

    But if there is a setback in one of those states, or one on Super Tuesday that seems particularly damaging, then, at that point, we may see a message of “look, get real. He can’t win. I’m the only one who can, whether you like it or not.”

    But the Romney campaign has certainly avoided going to that message thus far. Perhaps they just plan to do that as their last ditch effort to finish the thing off, only if needed.

  138. marc says:

    Santrums politics are religion based so it is deep ensconced in morality which is why issues like abortion, homosexuality and contraception make him so passionate.

  139. janz says:

    I don’t think the party ‘purists’ ever learn from their defeats. If they did, then they would be reflecting on choosing COD over Castle, Sharon Angle’s NV defeat over an easy Harry Reid, and Colorado’s Senatorial misstep in sidestepping a better suited Norton for a tea party’s Ken Buck.

  140. marc says:

    Corey you are really doubling down on putting your head in the sand and screaming LALALA huh?

  141. marc says:

    To learn you must be willing to be educated. The purist know b/c the Bible tells them so.

  142. Barrett says:

    #132 – Tim V, good post. I like that strategy

  143. janz says:

    Latest Pew Poll has Santorum up by 2 over Romney.

  144. Robbie says:

    13.A brokered convention is Wobbie’s wet dream but it won’t happen.

    I notice the moron was back on the other thread.

    ” Santorum’s positions will NOT result in a predestined loss in indies, mods and women. It just wont.”

    Nahhh, of course it won’t. Women and Indies will just love Santorum’s bizarre views, especially when Obama spends 800 million to highlight them.

    Comment by jason — February 13, 2012 @ 1:00 pm

    Internet tough guy alert!

  145. Corey says:

    No, I just see no need to panic.

    I have been supporting the same candidate since the process got under way at the beginning of last year.

    He has by far the most delegates, has gotten by far the most number of votes thus far, has by far the most money, by far the biggest organization, and is seen as by far the most electable.

    Why should I be in a state of panic on February 13?

    I’m not that old, but I’ve been through a few Presidential elections now. If I live and die every day, especially in a general election on every poll result or every news cycle, I’m going to keel over.

    My blood pressure is high enough as it is, so I think it only makes sense to be optimistic.

  146. Cory says:

    I think a loss to Obama would prompt a pretty severe Republican civil war, no matter who the nominee is.

    Sensible Republicans will blame the crazy Republicans if the nominee isn’t Romney, and crazy Republicans will blame the sensible Republicans if the nominee is Romney.

    The Republican party does need a civil war, though.
    Thought, curiousity, science, pragmatism… these things are under attack within the Republican party, and need to be defended. Those who prefer rhetoric and hyperbole need to be brought low.

  147. Corey says:

    I remember the day after the 2004 elections, where Democrats had lost to George W. Bush and were supposed to be in a state of civil war that they would not get over for a while.

  148. Barrett says:

    #147 – I don’t completely agree with your statement, but the party does need to be purged of the crazies.

    Doing so would bring many independents in

  149. jan says:

    During this civil war, the Democrats rule uninterrupted for a generation.

    Let’s just run Jeb Bush please

  150. janz says:

    Party purists are always threatening to run a 3rd party candidate. They seem to think their faction is the larger body of voters in the GOP. Sarah Palin and Rush Limbaugh have fanned these flames of discontent, IMO, dividing the party into them and the elites, very much like Obama is dividing the country into the haves and have nots.

  151. Robbie says:

    The professional political pundits who comment on this site like Jason clearly don’t understand how a contested convention would work.

    A contested convention would need three candidates to remain strong. That means Newt would need to do well in the South while Santorum does well in the Midwest. Big, big ifs.

    If it ever became clear no one would reach 1144 delegates, anyone who might want to jump into the race and win on the second or third ballot would likely need to enter by early June.

    Candidate X would need time to set up a staff, raise money, and woo delegates for the second or third or fourth ballots. Entering in June would give that person three months.

    The professionals who post here make it sound as Christie or Daniels or Jeb could be unwittingly drafted on Wednesday and then show up for a nominating speech on Thursday. Of course not.

    In the famous 1920 election, all of the Republicans who wanted the nomination came to Chicago with campaigns set and ready to go. The same would be true if it happened this time. While the convention might choose someone not in the race right now, the person chosen would have made his intentions known months before the convention was held.

  152. jan says:

    The comparisons don’t really work Corey. In 2004 the divisions within the Democrat Party weren’t that deep. They flirted with Howard Dean for a little bit but quickly came to there senses. Also Kerrys defeat was narrow. The flip of Ohio or Florida would have put him in the White House.

    With Republicans it’s choose two candidate who would lose massively against Obama or choose won flawed candidate who could make a race of it. The first option seems to be winning out.

  153. Marv says:

    marc,

    Please explain which of Santorum’s positions you find to be objectionable. Your assertion that Santorum does not believe in freedom and liberty seems to be a little over the top, so I’m curious to know what he has said that you find so troubling.

  154. Corey says:

    We don’t live in 1920 anymore.

  155. DW says:

    If there was a true conservative running for the GOP nomination, I would be all for him/her. But the best, most conservative leaning, credible candidate we have is Romney. But it is folly to pick someone else, and have a fantasy where you pretend that candidate is some strong conservative who will beat Romney then Obama.

  156. Cory says:

    Corey, I think the civil war is what would help the Republicans rebound, with new purpose in 2014, 2016. (This is all, of course, assuming an Obama win, which is not inevitable.)

    If the party keeps getting pulled farther over into crazy-land, I see a slow slide.

  157. Corey says:

    I’m saying jan is that if Romney is nominated, either we will win, or G-d forbid, he doesn’t against an incumbent, with all those inherent advantages, and the party will probably be fine.

    If we nominate a Santorum or a Gingrich, we already have enough problems as it is.

  158. Marv says:

    Corey,

    Was your #155 for me?

  159. EML says:

    Wobbie, the nominee is going to be someone who is currently in the race. Even a ‘brokered convention’ will lead to one of these guys being the nominee. So what’s the point of rooting for a brokered convention?

  160. Corey says:

    Negative Marv.

  161. Barrett says:

    #158 – I agree. Since Romney helps down ticket, the fringe crazies wont be able to blame him if Obama gets another term. With stronger senate and house majorities, the republicans will be able to stall him.

  162. You kidding me says:

    Once again (for about the thousandth time) Jason, and others, elections simply do not work according to the theories you guys believe in.

    They never have.

    They are more emotional and guy level comfort level selections, not “so and so is too socially conservative, so I a mod or indie or female will not pick him” etc.

    VOTERS DO *NOT* tend to select upon the basis of hard analysis of past votes or line by line agreement, etc.

    You have yet, Jason, or any of you, to produce SHRED of evidence for your case.

    Sure, Santy could lose. So could Romney.

    But anyone can see (with experience in history and knowing how voters REALLY tend to think) can see Romney is more likely, not less, to lose.

    The problem here is so many of you have bought the Establishment lie on this without real critical thinking that reasoning with you (like reasoning with a parrot)is all but impossible.

    Trying to win with somebody who reminds them of the guy that fired them, who supported bailouts and stimulus, who is wooden, who is Alf Landon and John Kerry rolled into one, is SUICIDAL.

    Voters do not care about social issues much this cycle, which is precisely why Santy’s stands, which have far more agreement with the country than you suspect even, does NOT harm him.

    The average out of work mod, undecided, indie, woman, is not going to reject an empathizing blue collar jobs talker over his views on abortion, unless he’s calling for executions of women in the street who have had them. Santorum connects with the middle class, and he’s not going to be rejected over gay marriage, etc.

    It’s amazing to me you guys cling to this idiocy.

    It was no more true in 2008, when an extreme social issue candidate named Obama who was so outside the mainstream he advocated letting BORN INFANTS die after the fact, and be won mods, indies, late deciders, women, etc.

    For the last time, do some research.

    In real life, voters do not pick logically. They do it emotionally. Given the choice of somebody who agrees with them most, and somebody they do not totally despise but feel more comfortable with, they will choose the latter.

    Thats why McCain beat Hayworth.

    That’s why Santy may beat Obama.

    That’s why Mitt cant beat ANYBODY.

  163. Marv says:

    Corey,

    Cubs this year? Or is it another disappointment?

  164. Robbie says:

    155.We don’t live in 1920 anymore.

    Comment by Corey — February 13, 2012 @ 3:31 pm

    I know that. I’m just saying people act as if a contested convention would produce a candidate who be without even a limited campaign structure around him. That would be the case.

  165. Corey says:

    Problem is the average voter does not despise Romney and that Santorum would be painted far more negatively in a general election.

    If you want to win, you go with common sense on this one.

  166. jan says:

    So Santorum wanting to ban contraception and make homosexuality illegal won’t matter then?

  167. Corey says:

    Well, 2012 certainly won’t be the Cubs’ year, but with a new regime, they are hopefully embarking on the right path, which should pay off in the near future.

  168. You kidding me says:

    Romney does not help down ticket because he turns the base off. He depresses it downwind. Even if he wins, it’s likely a squeaker, and the base depressing effect counters any “electability” edge Romney could ever have.

    You see, hard conservatives, and especially hard social cons, are the car/van drivers to the pols and worker bees. They do not trust and will not walk on glass for Mitt. They might for Santorum.

    The foot soldiers help drag peeps to the polls, and the base may not turn out for Mitt just to get rid of Obama.

    That’s why we must all:

    Pick Rick.

  169. jan says:

    Voters do not care about social issues much this cycle, which is precisely why Santy’s stands, which have far more agreement with the country than you suspect even, does NOT harm him.

    Comment by You kidding me — February 13, 2012 @ 3:33 pm

    There’s manjrotiy agreement to ban contraception, homosexuality and all abortion even in the cases of rap and incest?

  170. Robbie says:

    160.Wobbie, the nominee is going to be someone who is currently in the race. Even a ‘brokered convention’ will lead to one of these guys being the nominee. So what’s the point of rooting for a brokered convention?

    Comment by EML — February 13, 2012 @ 3:33 pm

    Firstly, I know you think you’re funny guy with Wobbie stuff, but keep on using it if it makes you feel better.

    Second, if no one enters the convention with 1144, why should we expect someone who couldn’t close the deal to do so then, especially Romney.

    I believe Romney will win enough delegates before the convention, but he’s a wimpy candidate who can’t even put away the clownish candidates running against him.

  171. Corey says:

    A contested convention is about 1 out of 1000 right now.

    It’s just not going to happen.

    Perhaps one or more or all of them officially stay in until the last primary in June, but the voters will have spoken by then, and there is likely to be a clear leader, and there will be immense pressure (not to mention severe financial problems for the others) to end it and support the nominee.

  172. jenny says:

    Why do people follow Rush? Don’t they know that he playing for fools?

  173. jan says:

    Yea the foot soldiers sure help drive those vans for COD and Angle, didn’t they?

  174. Corey says:

    Amazing then that all these polls are showing Romney has the highest favorables of any GOP candidate.

    I’m at the point on here where I really do not know who is a troll and who is just clueless.

  175. Corey says:

    By the way, no better “foot soldiers” out there than a bunch of energized Mormons.

    Perhaps there are some in the party who fear that if they are going door to door for Romney, they may secretly be trying to convert people as well along the trail.

  176. EML says:

    169 – the base is irrelevant in the GE. Every election of the past 40 has been won by the guy who can get the most moderates to vote for him.

  177. You kidding me says:

    Santorum is not easier to portray negatively. Mittens is, because nobody believe him. Nobody, but NOBODY trusts him.

    Sheesh, his OWN SUPPORTERS only back him BECAUSE they think “he can win against Obama” etc.

    Not even true, mind you, but they support him over that, and NOT because they are FOR him.

    At least SOME of Santy’s supporters are KIND OF for him, and also against Mitt big time, but there’s SOME enthusiam.

    For Christ’s sake did you even watch SNL last week???

    Even they “get it” over Mitt. They GET that he’s wooden, will say anything to get elected, has taken every possible position, lies with a smile, etc.

    What do you think week after week of “IN AUTHENTICITY” jokes on SNL are going to do to his chances vs Obama?

    Stop being so #^y* AFRAID of ever running any social conservative, already!

    It’s really getting old, Mittbots.

    They deserve to have one in the WH just as much as you Rockefeller clowns do, and we’ve lost election after election with Dole/Ford/Alf Landon clones like Mittens.

    Heck, on affirmative action grounds alone, Santy deserves a shot, LOL.

    Especially considering the track record of moderates is abysmal!

  178. Corey says:

    178. ok, now THAT is a troll. Well done.

  179. EML says:

    2010 didn’t happen because the base was fired up. It was because the middle was fired up against Obamacare and Democrats in general. You just have to look at the swing in party affiliation to understand this. There was a large swing to the right in party affiliation in 2010. The base doesn’t change part affiliation – swing voters do. Firing up the base gets you Goldwater.

  180. Jeff G. says:

    Obama released his fiscal 2013 budget. It’s a nice shot in the arm for the entitlement state.

  181. DW says:

    If four years of having the marxist Barrack Hussein Obama trampling our freedoms, stealing our future, and pissing on the constitution isn’t enough to get the GOP base out to vote him out of office, then there is nothing that will get them out to vote.

  182. SUSYQUE says:

    What?
    Rush today…
    Look, folks, as you know, I’ve not endorsed anybody, and I’ve not chosen anybody. I’ve not expressed a preference here. This is a microcosm of why. I don’t want to endorse early, have stuff come up that you can’t defend or you have to make some flimsy excuse for. So as far as I’m concerned it’s just an information item, and the only reason I’m even spending any time on it is because Romney’s own consultant is the author of the sentence. The 2005 National Review article quoted Mike Murphy, top strategerist at the time, saying Romney had been a “pro-life Mormon faking it as a pro-choice friendly.” That’s in quotes. A pro-life Mormon faked it as a pro-choice friendly.

    END TRANSCRIPT

  183. GF says:

    If the so-called “base” needs a presidential candidate to motivate them to go out to the polls just so they can by chance also vote for a conservative Congress, then the “base” deserves neither a conservative president nor a conservative Congress; they can suffer the liberal Congress that will take its place along with the rest of us. It is rather childish for them to whine if they don’t get the nominee they want (presumably Rick) and then threaten to or actually stay home and let the only lever of power we have go down the sh*tter.

    They need to take a chill pill and pull a ’96; suck up the top of the ticket loss and save the House (plus maybe, just maybe, pick up the Senate setting up a nice big win in ’14).

  184. Barrett says:

    #178 – Why are you still posting here?

    Nobody is going to trust Santard to be conservative when his voting record is spotted with liberal tendencies.

    The only guarantee you’ll get from him is some sort of pro life anti gay marriage declaration. Nothing of substance.

  185. EML says:

    178 – See post 19. Nobody is voting FOR Santorum. It’s all the brain dead ABRs who are voting AGAINST Romney. If people were voting FOR Santorum, then they would have been for him in the beginning, not wavering support between the flavor of the week Perry, Gingrich, Cain, Santorum.

  186. jan says:

    And it starts

    Santorum favors the restrictions on the combat role of women in the military.

    Rick Santorum: Women In Combat Could Create ‘Compromising Situation’ Because Of ‘Emotions’

    And its on video.

    God help us all.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/02/10/rick-santorum-women-military-combat-roles_n_1267851.html

  187. GF says:

    “Santorum is not easier to portray negatively.”

    Thanks! I haven’t laughed so hard in ages.

    :-)

  188. EML says:

    184 – exactly. Anyone who stays home and doesn’t vote for Romney is not ‘the base’.

  189. jason says:

    You kidding me must be a troll.

    Nobody is that stupid.

  190. DW says:

    I consider myself a “social conservative” and I am strongly for Romney because I want to beat Obama. To do that, we need a CREDIBLE candidate. One who has executive experience and proven leadership skills. Romney is the only one of the four choices we have that fits that profile.

  191. GF says:

    187- Santorum does not know anything more about real combat than he does about fornicating (except that he does not want to outright ban the former).

  192. janz says:

    #175 Actually Romney favorables are shrinking. I think his unfavorables loom somewhere close to 50% and his favorables are in the vicinity of mid 30′s. All the negative campaigning and GOP infighting have taken their toll on Romney — not so much on Santorum..yet.

  193. EML says:

    KEENE, N.H. — Republican presidential candidate Rick Santorum called Friday for immediate cuts to Social Security benefits, risking the wrath of older voters and countless others who balk at changes to the entitlement program.

    “We can’t wait 10 years,” even though “everybody wants to,” Santorum told a crowd while campaigning in New Hampshire and looking to set himself apart from his Republican rivals four days before the New Hampshire primary.

    Most of his opponents have advocated phasing in a reduction and say immediate cuts would be too big a shock to current and soon-to-be retirees.
    ====================================
    How is this guy going to win Florida?

  194. Barrett says:

    DW – I could care less about gay marriage, but I’m very much pro life, so I guess that makes me a social conservative.

    That being said, electability is my big issue, and Mitt is more electable that Santard

  195. Bitterlaw says:

    Sheesh, his OWN SUPPORTERS only back him BECAUSE they think “he can win against Obama” etc.

    THAT IS THE ONLY REASON THAT MATTERS!

  196. Scott says:

    Here is a comparison between Ramussen and Gallup for the last three(3) days of their respective tracking polls for Obama’s approval rating:

    Ras Gallup
    —– ——

    Friday 44% 48%
    Sat 52% 44%
    Sun 54% 46%

  197. jason says:

    You kidding me wants to be Wobbie when he grows up. Hasn’t reached concern troll level yet.

  198. Corey says:

    I think Romney can beat Obama, and that’s a very important thing of course, but as a down the line conservative, he has had my support for President for issues related to ideology, competence, and character as well since 2007.

    So, it’s completely false to say that Romney does not have supporters who are with him on the issues.

  199. DW says:

    Santorum believes in FREEDOM…

    He wants couples to be FREE to have as many children as biologically possible before menopause hits.

    He wants women to be FREE to stay home to knit and churn butter.

    He wants Unions to be FREE to get everything they want and drive businesses into the ground.

  200. GF says:

    194- Just as important, how does he feel morally justified breaking the contract with now or very soon to be retired voters who have paid up their social insurance over the decades with the promise that it would be there for them? People went along with the whole scheme on that premise, and while we know better now, the fix has to allow for the people for whom it is too late to do anything. The middle-aged and the young have time to work out different solutions; the elderly are screwed.

    If he cannot distinguish the difference, then he should be not be nominated much less elected. Then agian, he cannot distinguish conservatism and authoritarianism, either.

  201. jason says:

    I just waiting for Santorum to allude to PMS.

  202. Wes says:

    I’m speechless. This is ridiculous. Not only will Santorum run better than Mitt potentially in a GE, but now Bob Dole–he of the 92% lifetime ACU rating–is a Rockefeller Republican too? I guess the Sun revolves around the Earth too. Ay Dios Mio. This place has gone straight to Hell with the rabid lunacy typified by 178. I’m done. Rdelbov and others were right to leave. I have enough to deal with in my life without watching the GOP actively try to throw the election to Obama because of irrational hatred of Mitt Romney. Continue to squabble among yourselves and point fingers in blame at the lopsided loss in November if the anti-Romneys have their way.

  203. You kidding me says:

    The base is NOT irrelevant. The correct approach is, get the base on BOARD FIRST, then reach out to mods and indies and late deciders who tip the scales.

    You do NOT go WITH a moderate, you get your ideologue to pilfer more mod votes in the general, like Obama did, and then you get “big things done” when in, like Obamacare.

    You CAN get mod/indie votes with a non-mod, it happens all the time.

    If Michele Bachmann were our nominee, and Bernie Sanders became a Dem, and won the nomination, guess what?

    Either Bernie or Michele would end up winning, because the GOP or Dem person WOULD WIN, and would win indies/mods vs the other, since they have no other choice.

    What you guys are doing is outsmarting yourself.

    You think “most liberal senator, (Obama) is running so I pick a moderate Repub like Romney, and we will win indies!”

    If only it were that easy.

    The most extreme candidate, which is Obama, on social issues CAN win.

    Against anyone you put up.

    In a cycle like this, with a weak sitting prez, is a time to go for a more ideological candidate, not less.

    You do so also because if you do not, and WIN with Romney, it’s not a real gain that means much of anything because hes NOT a conservative.

    So, you will not see any liberal gains reversed, only seat warming for the next liberal elected that keeps advancing their agenda.

    The GOP really is the stupid party. Liberals are much smarter than us!

    They go for the fences, every time, without apology, and as a result, WHEN they win, as 2008, it actually matters in terms of advancing their world view.

  204. Waingro says:

    #197, yikes, Friday’s Ras # looks like the outlier. Guess the contraception botch isn’t having any effect.

  205. JayT says:

    RAS is Agenda Polling. I heard he is A Santorum Backer.

  206. DW - GOP Establishment says:

    196.Sheesh, his OWN SUPPORTERS only back him BECAUSE they think “he can win against Obama” etc.

    THAT IS THE ONLY REASON THAT MATTERS!

    Comment by Bitterlaw — February 13, 2012 @ 3:53 pm

    And conversely, Rick supporters only back him BECAUSE they think “he can send the establishment a message” etc.

    –DW, GOP establishment.

  207. Corey says:

    I remember when Newt said that women should not serve in combat because they get “infections.”

  208. Ted O says:

    #163 “Thats why McCain beat Hayworth.” Not true…I voted for McCain because JD was an idiot who I supported previously in my conressional District. Most people voted for McCain because they saw all JD’s baggage. I do not like McCain and have called his office many times to yell at this staff for his positions.

  209. DW - GOP Establishment says:

    I recommend that if you are for Romney, add – GOP Establishment after your handle, just so we are easy to identify.

  210. GF says:

    DW – I could care less about gay marriage, but I’m very much pro life, so I guess that makes me a social conservative.

    Barrett, you G_d damned RINO! True conservatives hate the flamers; go pick up your RINO card at the union desk.

  211. janz says:

    #203 wes, don’t be too harsh to judge everyone’s opinion by the poster in youkiddingme poster in #178, whose handle may be just an imposter for someone else.

  212. GF - GOP Establishment DoD Liaison says:

    Wes! Don’t flee; I need other establishment RINOs to help me convert the true conservative base!

    :-)

  213. Corey says:

    Do people remember that Rick Santorum supported Arlen Specter for President of the United States?

  214. Barrett says:

    #199 – If I’m not mistaken, Romney believes that it should be up to each state to determine how they want to cover individuals medically, if at all.

    I’ll take that over Obamacare any day

  215. Brandon says:

    8.2 on the Maxwell Scale. Impressive.

  216. Tim V-social con, tea party says:

    Go Mitt !

  217. DW - GOP Establishment says:

    Wes, don’t leave. Just ignore these trolls. Something must be going right if the trolls are all worked up.

  218. janz says:

    Barrett

    You are correct about Romneycare. It relates only to MA, was designed for that populace, and continues to be liked by the majority of people and doctors in that state. Romneycare is simply being distorted by both Obama (who doesn’t want to run against Romney) and the far right throwing their support towards ABR.

  219. Barrett - GOP Youth Vote says:

    Wes, don’t leave.

    I guess we’re wearing our labels today?

  220. Rick Santorum- True Union Fellating "Back-to-the-kitchen thy pregnant wenches!" Conservative says:

    214- You’re damned right I did! That Toomey crackpot would have made me sit next to Joe Hoeffel for two whole freaking years before I got tossed out on my @ss to a cardboard cutout in a cheap suit!

  221. Barrett - GOP Youth Vote says:

    #211 – Shoot, I’ve been found out!

  222. Corey says:

    I’m not talking about Santorum supporting Specter over Pat Toomey.

    I’m talking about Rick Santorum being on stage in the front row and applauding when Arlen Specter announced his candidacy for President in 1995.

    The video exists.

  223. Rick Santorum- True Union Fellating "Back-to-the-kitchen thy pregnant wenches!" Conservative says:

    222- And don’t forget to pick up the mandatory “Thou Shalt Not Tolerate Gays, Women in Combat, Rear-entry Intercourse, Free Market Capitalism and Canine Marriage” certificate while you are there as well.

  224. You kidding me says:

    Well, I’m not a troll, but I give up.

    Liberals will win, for sure, because you guys are determined to give away the store before a shot is fired.

    Has it ever occurred to any of you WHY liberals are so successful?

    Hint, it’s because they defend their positions, no matter the polls, come heck or high water.

    You would do well to learn that ONE thing from them.

    Typical generic Republicans do not get that this is a knife fight to the death, one they are a lot more determined to win than us, it seems.

    You keep “settling” and rationalizing yourself in ways liberals never do.

    That’s why they are kicking your a$$es and all you have to show for it is a rare win by a Nixon type who, when you DO win, puts in wage and price controls, fails on SCOTUS picks, and gives you Freddie Mac on his watch.

    I’ve been a CONSERVATIVE Republican longer than many of you have been alive, and it never ceases to amaze me the self defeating behavior of my own party.

    The self-defeaters are not the Santorum voters, they are the Mitt backers who think any hollow victory is an adequate one against Obama in the fall.

    If it means giving up every single principle, so be it. Just as long as we “win”.

    It’s not a win when we elect somebody who will use John Sununu to likely pick another David Souter.

    It’s not a win when we elect somebody who fathered Obamacare.

    It’s not a win, because it is surrender.

    I’m not a troll, I’m just frustrated by the incredible short sighted stupidity of people here backing Romney.

    You people are destroying the Republican party and the nation, you might as well vote Democrat and save us the trouble…

  225. Bitterlaw - Establishment RINO says:

    Wes – you can’t leave until you rewrite your Goodbye Rant. I’m sorry but it sucked. I know you can do better. Send it to MD for his review and then post it.

  226. Cory says:

    I’m gonna give that a 9.1 on the Maxwell.

    Very, very well done.

  227. Corey says:

    I think “you kidding me” IS MD having some fun with us.

  228. Rick Santorum- True Union Fellating "Back-to-the-kitchen thy pregnant wenches!" Conservative says:

    223- You clearly haven’t been paying attention; I explained how strongly I grimaced while he was bloviating about his social stances during that speech. Those facial expressions alone exonerate me and free me of any guilt for supporting that two-faced, party-swtiching back-stabber who sold out “true” conservatism more times than I ever had the chance to jump at.

  229. Barefoot says:

    If you were a Romney advisor, what suggestions would you give him on how to run his campaign from now until the MI and Arizona primaries on the 28th?
    Comment by janz — February 13, 2012 @ 2:01 pm

    I’d advise Mitt to go 100% personal against Santorum. Focus on the weirdness of the way they grieved for their dead baby. Call his wife a whore who slept with an abortionist. Call Rick a radical Catholic who wants to impose the Pope’s weird beliefs on all Americans. Say that his sweater vest is infected with malaria-carrying fleas. Rip Santorum to shreds.

    This has worked wonders in the past. No wonder Mitt’s favorability rating is doing so well!

  230. GF - GOP Establishment DoD Liaison says:

    MD, if you are out there, don’t let me languish; give me a sign (like some cheap, gratuitous yet totally hilarious shot at Gary Massengill, for instance).

  231. Barrett - GOP Youth Vote says:

    #225 – Self defeating behavior? I want Mitt Romney to win the nomination because he holds conservative views AND does well against Obama in a GE matchup.

    I don’t know where you’re getting this defeatist mentality stuff from

  232. GF - GOP Establishment DoD Liaison says:

    Personally, I think his sweater vests look like they are made otu of cheap acrylic; a man of his means should have cashmere. He could have billed the Commonwealth for them, or perhaps just earmarked them like his buddy Murtha.

  233. janz says:

    Lots of snark around here today — perhaps an invasion of mosquitos.

  234. Bitterlaw says:

    MD is out there. He is always out there. So is Jul – when he’s not nailing a psychotic felon who was brought to justice by the best Governor in America.

  235. GF - GOP Establishment DoD Liaison says:

    Bitter, a governor with a lower UE rate than that joker some were trying to foist on us a while back, no?

    Did you see my quote concerning the sincerity of the bishops up thread? I felt that you were uniquely qualified to comment.

  236. GF - GOP Establishment DoD Liaison says:

    Time for my union lunch break, except that I am still on actiive duty and not a DoD contractor yet; I merely take advantage of the rules that they negotiate for my colleagues. In light of that, perhaps they should be allowed to garnish dues from my wages.

  237. Archibald Cunningham (R) says:

    Romney is going to carpet-bomb Michigan and Ariz. with millions of dollars in ads. These are primaries and they are big stakes.

  238. Archibald Cunningham (R) says:

    He did so in Florida. :)

    And it worked.

  239. Bitterlaw says:

    GF – I am the defnition of sincerity. If I like you, I sincerely like you. If I don’t like you, I sincerely don’t like you. I sincerely like you – despite your status as a government employee who likes to play on boats.

  240. J T says:

    You know that it is the silly season when Cory, and his 3rd rate Canadian Math degree, gives the GOP advice.

  241. EML says:

    225 – Liberals are successful because they have a Big Tent. Liberal economic policies are deplorable, but independent votes flock to the Democratic Party because the Party Purists in the Republican Party drive them there with their hardline stances.

  242. Corey says:

    If you were to ask liberals, they would tell you that they have not been successful at all in regards to what conservatives have done. They wish Obama was able to get as much of his agenda done as GWB did.

    And they have a point.

    They also think Obama is basically a moderate Republican, which is ridiculous, but it shows us where they are coming from.

    As bad as Obama is, he has not enacted close to everything they would want to, which is why it is so crucial he is denied another term.

    And for all this talk about how Romney brought about Obamacare, putting aside the fact that Obama was criticizing Romneycare on the 2008 campaign trail, we ought to remember that the real inspiration for what they wanted would be a Canadian style single payer for one, and then a public option as the backup.

    We forget how much Obamacare had to be watered down as it is.

  243. J T says:

    The Church needs to figure out what their real message is going to be in the Future.

    1. The Notre Dame Heirachy is now going after Obama on the Contraception Issue, but of Couse they had Obama speak on campus when many alums thought it was pathetic.

    2. Dolan and the rest supported Obama care on the first House vote that included the Public Option, and were suped by Stupak.

    what is it going to be for the Church going forward?

    Socialism?

  244. J T says:

    242. Wrong EM. If that were true, Bush would have lost in 2000 and 2004

  245. T J says:

    Yeah EM you are such a dummy!

  246. Phil says:

    Obama to hike subsidies to Volt buyers.

    Hey folks, he’s just getting warmed up for term #2. You aint seen nothing yet. Just wait until he has the election behind him.

    The left gone wild will be the subheading for an his second term.

  247. GF - GOP Establishment DoD Liaison says:

    I sincerely like you as well, Bitter, even if you are a beer quaffing swetare hater (although in light of your fellow Pennsylvanian’s recent success, I might find myself turn off by them as well).

    No more boats, though! At least not as it looks right now. I may retire form a desk after all.

    OK, back to my inflated lunch; off to the deli (for hot pastrami only; no cheesesteak here). :-(

  248. Bitterlaw says:

    I believe that the Catholic Church bought in to the idea that Obamacare would provide care for the uninsured and poor. That is the mission of the Church so I can understand the goal even if I don’t agree with the method. The Church is very liberal on economic issues.

  249. bio mom says:

    So, should Mitt run third party if the crazies manage to get Santorum the nomination? Since Obama would win anyway, it might be fun. (I am joking of course). Trying not to cry about this awful turn of the Republican party and the domination of it by the right wing I am starting to understand the Democarats.

  250. Corey says:

    My boss will be gone tomorrow and I will be having a difficult day filling in, so I hope somebody else steps in to help stem the tide of panicking on here in regards to the Mittster.

    I can’t believe both MD and Wes have gone down. We cannot let BJG win in the end!

  251. Marv says:

    GF,

    Any word from the Review Board yet?

  252. hellbelly says:

    If the definition of a conservative is “a liberal who’s gotten mugged”, maybe we can now expect Stephen Breyer to vote with Clarence Thomas.

  253. Scott says:

    When you throw in leaners,the Pew Poll is D+10; D49%,R39%.

  254. Barefoot says:

    If you were a Romney advisor, what suggestions would you give him on how to run his campaign from now until the MI and Arizona primaries on the 28th?
    Comment by janz — February 13, 2012 @ 2:01 pm

    I would advise him to hire that poster here with the long vulgar names to serve as the official Romney Spokesman. He would really help sell the Romney Brand.

    “Vote Romney! If you don’t, %$#@ you!”

  255. Bitterlaw says:

    Corey – I’m not going anywhere. Ever.

  256. Corey says:

    You will if your wife tells you it’s us or her.

  257. Corey says:

    I seriously do think it should be made hard for Santorum to go after Romney on anything social issue related, when it can be pointed out that Santorum had no problems endorsing Romney for President over Huckabee.

    The Romney campaign really should make more issue of that 2008 endorsement. The only way Santorum can respond is by basically conceding that Romney is better than McCain.

  258. Scott says:

    In the Congressional Generic Ballot,Ras shows the GOP +2 over the Dems for the week ending February 12th.His polling amazes me by its inconsistencies.During the week,he had a poll which showed by a 52% to 46% margin that the electorate considered Reps more “extreme”.Yet more people will vote for Republicans! Illogical to the “extreme”!

  259. Addisonst says:

    So who is u kidding me?

    So much angst over Santorum. He isn’t going to be the nomney.

  260. J T says:

    Scott, RAS needs to do a separate Weekend Index.

    Where would Obama be without Saturday abd Sunday Polling?

  261. J T says:

    I agree Add. I truly believe there are Dem foces that have infiltrated the GOP, to try and take out Romney.

    We saw this strategy in 2002 in the Cal Gov Race. Gray Davis knocked out the electable LA GOP Mayor Riordan, so he could face extreme Simon in the GE.

    Trojan Hoses are in effect

  262. CPA says:

    Pew – Santorum 30
    Romney 28
    National
    SMOD – Mittbot Meltdown.

  263. GF - GOP Establishment DoD Liaison says:

    259- Scott, RAS also uses different samples on some of his questions; he does that a lot in the head to head numbers, too. Drives me crazy!

  264. J T says:

    PEEEE YUUUUUUU.

    CPA, if you have to use the worst US pollster to make a case for Rick, you are in trouble

  265. GF - GOP Establishment DoD Liaison says:

    Marv, board found me fit; I need to pass a sea duty screening to see if I can be sent to a ship. If I don’t pass, they might can me anyway and not let me stay to my retirement date. Waiting anxiously…

  266. Corey says:

    FWIW, Michigan Governor Rick Snyder is going to announce his endorsement before the primary.

    Think it’s a good bet who that is going to be.

    And speaking of Snyder, in 2010, he was the example of a candidate who beat all sorts of more ideological opponents in a primary, and went on to win a big general election victory, because he was able to get votes from Independents and Democrats.

  267. GF - GOP Establishment DoD Liaison says:

    262- What a blown opportunity that was, JT. We had Doofus on the ropes, too. Both Riordan and Bill Jones (SoS at the time) were highly electable and well liked. Indeed, Jones was reelected in 1998 as the rest of the GOP ticket was blown away. Davis reportedly feared him most, but also worried about Riordan locking up LA, thus dooming Doofus in the GE.

    Oddly enough, Simon was going to run for state treasurer before GWB’s people pushed him to challenge Jones (whom they had not forgiven for backing McCain in 2000). Simon could have won that race with Jones or Riordan clobbering Doofus over the blackouts, budget scandals et al. Also not to be forgotten is that Tom McClintock ran ahead of the losing ticket, coming within 16,000 votes out of 8 million to win the Controller’s race against a millionaire who outspent him 8-1. But for Bush’s meddling in our state politics (which were none of his or his people’s business), we could have avoided 1) Doofus getting reelected (along with at least a few other dems), and more importantly, 2) avert the inevitable Schwarzenkennedy disaster that followed in the recall.

  268. Corey says:

    Gray Davis in 2002 was the only candidate I can remember seeing getting booed by his supporters at his own victory speech.

  269. Brandon says:

    “because he was able to get votes from Independents and Democrats.”

    That means he’s obviously a RINO.

  270. Corey says:

    I believe the GWB White House was behind Riordan.

    I don’t recall ever hearing they wanted Simon in the race to stick it to Jones, but who knows.

  271. GF - GOP Establishment DoD Liaison says:

    I remember coming home from work and seeing Davis still trailing Simon with about 40% counted. I was really surprised, but predicted that LA and SF would push him over the top, maybe 4-5 points. Sure enough, they did.

    What was funny was that he apparently chewed out his staff and campaign advisors when the first returns came in; he really thought he was going to lose to Simon for a while, and that chapped his hide. :-)

  272. GF - GOP Establishment DoD Liaison says:

    272- Negative. Some of the insiders prodded him at first to get rid of Jones (a bad mistake, regardless), but once Simon emerged as an actual conservatives, the hired goons/guns abandoned the moderate Riordan. They should have stayed out period.

  273. J T says:

    Another example of the Liberal Playbook. Was the 1996 Senate Race in IL.

    Lt Gov Kustra was backed by popular Gov Edgar, but the Dems and Dick Durbin helped Far right Al Salvi get the nom, and he got crsuhed in the GE

  274. Corey says:

    Al Salvi, who went to High School with Santorum (though they did not know each other), is heading up Santorum’s campaign in IL now.

  275. GF - GOP Establishment DoD Liaison says:

    Basically, Bush and his people expected Mccain to make nice and campaign for him in ’00 and ’04, but made sure to assassinate all of Mac’s associates they could get rid of. Classy people; way better than the nuts who run the joint now, but not exactly whom I would choose in a perfect world.

  276. GF - GOP Establishment DoD Liaison says:

    Back to the JT’s original point, had Jones been left alone in the gov race, he was already a credible conservative. It is doubtful whether Simon would have challenged him (it was Jones’ turn, so to speak), or even that such a challenge would have been successful.

  277. Corey says:

    They didn’t seem to have a problem with Lindsey Graham in South Carolina in 2002 though.

    I would be surprised if Karl Rove was really out to get the McCainiacs at that point.

  278. DrJay says:

    Let’s be sure Wes really has stepped out before starting a conversation about Al Salvi.

  279. GF - GOP Establishment DoD Liaison says:

    Say what you will, Corey, but the difference is that Graham started with and stuck with McCain. Jones had been on Team Bush, but they had a falling out. He then switched over to McCain. It was a revenge game pure and simple. I was on the ground then; everyone on the campaign knew it.

  280. Corey says:

    People often remember their first Presidential vote but can everyone remember the first candidates they ever voted for in a general election for U.S. Senate and Governor?

    For me, it’s Al Salvi and George Ryan.

  281. Barefoot says:

    Super Tuesday Predictions:
    Romney: MA, VT, VA, ID, WY
    Santorum: ND, OH, TN, OK, AK
    Gingrich: GA

    Mitt wins the Northeast and Mormon West. Santorum stay strong in the Midwest and starts to take Gingrich’s South. Palin effect swings Alaska to Santorum.

    The rest of March does not look very Mitt-friendly, with Southern states (MS, AL, LA) and Midwest (MO, IL). Mitt’s best opportunities may be Hawaii, Samoa, and Puerto Rico.

  282. GOP Establishment Parakeet says:

    Wow the fuqqtards are out in force Today

    Bonus week at the DNC?

  283. GOP Establishment Parakeet says:

    224 that fake handle rocks!

  284. CPA says:

    Who let the Parakeet out of his cage. Time to change the NY Times, I guess.

  285. CPA says:

    First we have a bird of a platypus, now we have a bird of crap weasels. How about a fat toad. Yeh, try a reptile next time.

  286. GOP Establishment Parakeet says:

    Many things change but CPA is always a dumbfuqq

  287. CPA says:

    Maybe I’ll be Newt’s Parakeet. But by the looks of Newt he eats Parakeet for appetizer.